When They Tell You The Science Is In, It Never Is

[Aloysius]

Well, I did work in the climate weather business for ten years. And worked with climate modellers, data scientists and downloaded some satellite data from JPL and as well as oceanographic measurements from the US Navy (all free for you to access to confirm any conspiracy you may have).

 

The labelling is really done by you, e.g. elitism, resorting to name calling in the hope the discussion will go personal instead of on the topic. I can play that game, but I label myself as "better than that"!

 

Profit and consumerism at the expense of mother nature. Whatever side we stand on, we'd all suffer the same consequences. Let's hope the bush season season can be kind on some of us.

 

 

 

Elitism is name calling?

 

Hello? you are attempting to take this to the playground - and you being better than that too! :dance:

[POWERZONE]

Elitism is a superiority complex to wit: someone who is not an elite but pretends to be one.

Parliament house is full of them.

A true elite has no need to pretend they're better than everyone else.

[Aloysius]

Elitism is a superiority complex to wit: someone who is not an elite but pretends to be one.


Parliament house is full of them.


A true elite has no need to pretend they're better than everyone else.

 

 

 

That's a very sound point you make PZ!!

 

Regrettably Parliament House is not the only roosting place for elitists.

 

Heavens above, us laymen would be far better off to accept every pearl they cast before us.

 

The very phrase " The science is in" used by the Global warming  oops, Climate change afficionados betrays the elitism involved.

 

It's the same as saying " We know everything and you better get used to it"

 

But it's self evident and Myrantz has conceded this: that the science is never in.

 

One could easily progress then from  elitist Pollies and Climate change groupies, to Industrial Relations clubs, Taxpayer funded journalists, organised religious groups, oh, and Cricket Australia.

 

I'm quite sure that you could add your own particular identification parade.

[POWERZONE]

Steve Smith is an elite cricketer, one of the best in the world.

IMO he does not have a superiority complex.

Elitism is good.

But does he go around telling everybody that he's superior to everyone else?

 

If he's humble then probably not. 

 

I take my hat off to anyone who is good without being elitist.

 

Innit the Aussie way? 

[treblid]

It's the same as saying " We know everything and you better get used to it"

Who actually said that? As far as I know the phrase like "The Science Is In" is only used in media, and audiophiles... Not researchers in general. And definitely nobody I know.

[Aloysius]

Well if you don't know them ......................

[POWERZONE]

Perhaps there is "good" elite and "bad" elite?

One way to find out... ask them to take a bow

[Aloysius]

<span>elite</span><span>noun [<span> <span>C</span>, <span>+ sing/pl verb </span>]</span></span>
 <span style="margin-left:5px;"><span style="color:rgb(232,68,39);font-size:1em;font-weight:bold;">UK <span style="font-family:cdoicons;font-size:.875em;color:inherit;">​</span> </span><span style="font-size:1.063em;">/<span>iˈliːt/</span></span> </span><span style="margin-left:5px;"><span style="color:rgb(232,68,39);font-size:1em;font-weight:bold;">US <span style="font-family:cdoicons;font-size:.875em;color:inherit;">​</span> </span><span style="font-size:1.063em;">/<span>iˈliːt/</span></span></span>
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<div><a class="" title="Add this meaning to a wordlist">​</a>
<p class=""><span style="color:rgb(255,255,255);font-weight:bold;font-size:.8em;text-align:center;background-color:rgb(68,68,68);">C1 </span>the <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/rich" title="richest">richest</a>, most <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/powerful" title="powerful">powerful</a>, best-educated, or best-trained <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/group" title="group">group</a> in a <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/society" title="society">society</a>:

<div style="font-style:italic;margin:0px 0px 5px;"><span>the country's <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/educated" title="educated">educated</a> elite</span>
<span>a <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/member" title="member">member</a> of the elite</span>
 
 
elitist


<span>noun [<span> <span>C </span>]</span></span>
 <span style="margin-left:5px;"><span style="color:rgb(232,68,39);font-size:1em;font-weight:bold;">UK <span style="font-family:cdoicons;font-size:.875em;color:inherit;">​</span> </span><span style="font-size:1.063em;">/<span>iˈliː.tɪst/</span></span> </span><span style="margin-left:5px;"><span style="color:rgb(232,68,39);font-size:1em;font-weight:bold;">US <span style="font-family:cdoicons;font-size:.875em;color:inherit;">​</span> </span><span style="font-size:1.063em;">/<span>iˈliː.tɪst/</span></span> </span>mainly <span>disapproving</span>
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<p class="">someone who <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/believe" title="believes">believes</a> that some things should be <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/control" title="controlled">controlled</a> or <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/own" title="owned">owned</a> only by the <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/rich" title="richest">richest</a> or <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/best" title="best">best</a> <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/educated" title="educated">educated</a> <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/people" title="people">people</a>:

<div style="font-style:italic;margin:0px 0px 5px;"><span>They were elitists who had a <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/contempt" title="contempt">contempt</a> for <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/popular" title="popular">popular</a> <a class="" href="http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/politics" title="politics">politics</a>.</span>
 
 
<span>Elite = best, a good thing</span>
 
<span>Elitist = contempt for those perceived by them as not elite ie - ordinary.  A bad thing.</span>
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[Aloysius]

Who actually said that? As far as I know the phrase like "The Science Is In" is only used in media, and audiophiles... Not researchers in general. And definitely nobody I know.

 

 

Try Al Gore - testifying before the US Congress!

 

The science was in as proposed by Newton - for hundreds of years - no longer is it settled just ask Einstein, Planck, Bohr et al.

[treblid]

Try Al Gore - testifying before the US Congress!

I tried glooging Al Gore and "Science Is In" and congress.. No relevant results, can you point to an article where he said that to the congress?

 

The science was in as proposed by Newton - for hundreds of years - no longer is it settled just ask Einstein, Planck, Bohr et al.

I'm not a Séance :ph34r:. I will freak out if they do answer my question if I ask 'em.

 

Do you still buckle up every time you get into a vehicle? If yes, then consider Newtonian laws of motion settled. :wacky:

[Aloysius]

Seat belt wearing might be better explained by Adam Smith or Keynes.

 

Try http://www.thescienceisstillsettled.com/ for the Al Gore quote.

 

As for seances - I will put more faith in science thanks :

https://cmm.cit.nih.gov/intro_simulation/node1.html

 

Your academic background will be able to help you here.

 

Happy inquiring! :Hug:

 

PS if the science really was settled or "in" why do the folks who make a living out of these studies accept massive government grants?

 

Or more to the point why don't they advise governments to no longer fund them?

[treblid]

Seat belt wearing might be better explained by Adam Smith or Keynes.

 

Try http://www.thescienceisstillsettled.com/ for the Al Gore quote.

If you follow the link to your link, the article said:


"The science is settled, Gore told the lawmakers. "


That's not a direct quote. A direct quote, works something like this:

 

"This is not a partisan issue, this is a moral issue," Gore said. "And our children are going to be demanding this."



Put it this way, so far a lot of the data that has been gathered strongly suggested the sea water temps is rising. The sea water level is rising. Even the research you previously quoted that showed the earth is cooling down, the latest study suggested that could be wrong as it's underestimating the correction to be applied.


 

As for seances - I will put more faith in science thanks :
https://cmm.cit.nih.gov/intro_simulation/node1.html

 

Your academic background will be able to help you here.

 

Happy inquiring! :Hug:

 

PS if the science really was settled or "in" why do the folks who make a living out of these studies accept massive government grants?

 

Or more to the point why don't they advise governments to no longer fund them?

I would say climate science, while it's a complex and a chaotic system is easier to comprehend than quantum mechanics. Suggest you learn how to walk before trying to fly?


As for still requiring grants... Do you think measuring the weather system comes cheap? Do you think analysing those data is cheap? Even the computers used to store the data, and the computers used to run the models, they are not free.. If the government don't fund them? Is the private sector going to?

 

My own story tells me the private sector is not going to fund this.

[Aloysius]

If you follow the link to your link, the article said:


"The science is settled, Gore told the lawmakers. "


That's not a direct quote. A direct quote, works something like this:

 

"This is not a partisan issue, this is a moral issue," Gore said. "And our children are going to be demanding this."


Put it this way, so far a lot of the data that has been gathered strongly suggested the sea water temps is rising. The sea water level is rising. Even the research you previously quoted that showed the earth is cooling down, the latest study suggested that could be wrong as it's underestimating the correction to be applied.


 

I would say climate science, while it's a complex and a chaotic system is easier to comprehend than quantum mechanics. Suggest you learn how to walk before trying to fly?


As for still requiring grants... Do you think measuring the weather system comes cheap? Do you think analysing those data is cheap? Even the computers used to store the data, and the computers used to run the models, they are not free.. If the government don't fund them? Is the private sector going to?

 

My own story tells me the private sector is not going to fund this.

 

 

Myrantz I am aware of the articles content - clearly!

 

Manufacture what ever you like out of it I merely provided it at your request.

 

 

"Something like this" is a lame sort of counter I feel. 

 

As for your continuing apparent need to continue your elitist comments - there for all to see - gracious me, you probably do not realise that you are being elitist!!!

 

Think your degree is more than mine?

 

"Suggest you learn how to walk before trying to fly?" :Talking:  :Talking:  :Talking: 

 

 

 

 

There is a real world where sucking on the hind tit of the taxpayer is not available as it appears to be to those who need to continue with their Climate change religion..

 

It appears there has always been climate change, that there always will be, and that it has not just been invented/recognised by the present proponents of  slanted and small picture views.

 

If it's been warming it must have followed cooling, Present day attempts to dispute the hiatus of 17 years in the warming trend become more and more tenuous.

 

Here is an even handed article that may interest you:

http://www.nature.com/news/climate-chang...at-1.14525

[POWERZONE]

I'd love to know where this cooling is Aloy.

Tried unsuccessfully to sleep last Friday night when the temps were sitting at 37c at 1am. Hottest on record.

If warming is followed by cooling, it's not happening where I live.

On the contrary it's getting hotter every year.

So while other areas are enjoying this cooling our climate here is getting buggered over.

To me that's climate change.

[Aloysius]

I'd love to know where this cooling is Aloy.


Tried unsuccessfully to sleep last Friday night when the temps were sitting at 37c at 1am. Hottest on record.


If warming is followed by cooling, it's not happening where I live.


On the contrary it's getting hotter every year.


So while other areas are enjoying this cooling our climate here is getting buggered over.


To me that's climate change.

 

 

 

Hello I said there has always been climate change, that there always will be climate change, no argument here.

 

What I take issue with is non data driven hypotheses that just fail to occur.

 

there is more religion type hyperbole and apocryphal anecdotes than you can point a stick at.

 

Your personal experience related to temperature is hardly a scientific finding.

 

Did you bother to read the link I provided to Myrantz?

 

PS we have not had a hot summer here, highest temp has been 34 degrees in CQ so far.

 

 

As for CO2 and all that - the sun has a far more significance on global temperatures - an eleven year cycle seems to be evident.

 

Do some research the web is your friend.

 

Penguins believe in web feet!

[POWERZONE]

Yep. Read the link, briefly. We had a similar discussion around a year ago because at the time, hotlinks to websites limiting their graph data from 1998 to around 2012 were conveniently used as an impetus for their global cooling argument whilst forgetting that 1998 was very very very hot. I seem to remember saying last year would be hotter than the previous several.

2016 third straight hottest year on record: http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-news/2016-third-straight-hottest-year-on-record/news-story/64c8e10d908674a0fa84a7e8cad28962 

If my experience isn't scientific could the same thing be said of the cooling as claimed in an earlier post?
 
In any case my claim wasn't scientific, it's data. I'm copping increasing temps year on year - even in winter.
 
But where is this cooling? Can I have some? Can it be ducted here? Do I need frequent fire points? lol

[Aloysius]

Yep. Read the link, briefly. We had a similar discussion around a year ago because at the time, hotlinks to websites limiting their graph data from 1998 to around 2012 were conveniently used as an impetus for their global cooling argument whilst forgetting that 1998 was very very very hot. I seem to remember saying last year would be hotter than the previous several.

2016 third straight hottest year on record: http://www.news.com.au/world/breaking-news/2016-third-straight-hottest-year-on-record/news-story/64c8e10d908674a0fa84a7e8cad28962 


If my experience isn't scientific could the same thing be said of the cooling as claimed in an earlier post?

 

In any case my claim wasn't scientific, it's data. I'm copping increasing temps year on year - even in winter.

 

But where is this cooling? Can I have some? Can it be ducted here? Do I need frequent fire points? lol

 

 

C'mon up here mon ami!!!

[POWERZONE]

Too Hot! LOL http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-01-19/fe...er/8193844

[Aloysius]

Some data:  Beware the non linear scale over time! Note the variation prior to the  human epoch. Note the long term cooling!

 

http://gergs.net/2016/09/snyder-global-t...ure-graph/

 

[POWERZONE]

Aloy you'll make a fortune if you could sell a temperature gauge from the Eocene era :wow

 

Might need to be recalibrated to retain its "scientific" value though...

 

So is that graph saying global warming started to increase concurrently with industrialisation?

 

Maybe Holocen should really be Hotocen era? :Whistle: